Podcast Transcript 

Bart: Thanks for joining us, McKenzie.

McKenzie: Hi! I’m glad to be here.

Bart: Built to Stay is all about creating businesses with staying power that will succeed over time. You and your husband, Colby, started Thread Wallets five years ago, and from what I understand, it’s really taken off. We’re excited to hear your story and how your building Thread was to stay. So first off, McKenzie, where did you get the idea for Thread Wallets?

McKenzie: Oh, I can’t really take credit for the idea. It was more of my husband, but he had . . . We were out in Hawaii. Well, I guess I should say he was out in Hawaii playing soccer in 2013, and I was out in Hawaii at school. In 2013 we didn’t really know each other, but he had lost his wallet at the beach, and then was just using a rubber band or something to hold his cards together when he got everything back sorted out. When he went online to search for a new wallet, he went to Google and typed in men’s wallets, and then all he saw was like big bi-fold wallets or–

Bart: Big leather wallets.

McKenzie: Yes, like grandpa wallets. They were all just really big and bulky. There were slim and minimalist wallets, but they were very plain. So it’s still just like black elastic–

Bart: Yeah.

McKenzie: –brown leather, and about around the same time, coincidentally, he was taking a business class. He did entrepreneurship, so he was taking a class that was all about starting a Kickstarter campaign from start to finish and getting a little business off the ground through Kickstarter. He had been spending some time on Kickstarter and had realized that back in 2014 or 2013, when Kickstarter wasn’t as crowded, that minimalist wallets were just killing it. There were multiple minimalist wallets that had done like $50,000 . . . or $500,000, excuse me.

Bart: Wow, on Kickstarter?

McKenzie: On Kickstarter, yeah. $300,000, like, really well. He was like, “Okay, there’s obviously a need for these slim, minimalist wallets,” but he couldn’t find anyone that had personality or style to it. They were all just like I said, brown leather, black elastic. He really admired companies like Neff Headwear, Stance Socks, Skullcandy headphones, that had taken a really boring item and making it really cool.

Bart: Yeah.

McKenzie: That’s when the first Kickstarter campaign came into play, early 2014. He went to a local company called Beloved, if you’ve heard of them. They do like sublimated shirts, like really funky, like Cheetos on shirts and gummy bears on shirts.

Bart: Okay, cool.

McKenzie: He went to them with a plain piece of elastic and was like, “Hey, can I test to see if this will print on this material?” So he did, and it was the poop emoji.

Bart: Okay.

McKenzie: Yeah, so that was the first design on a Thread Wallet, and he came . . . We had started dating at this time and he came and picked me up and was like, “Oh my gosh, you’ve got to look and see like what this is, there’s viability to this idea. I can get designs onto this elastic.”

Bart: And it looked pretty good.

McKenzie: I mean, for the poop emoji, yeah. I–

Bart: You could tell what it was.

McKenzie: Yeah, oh yeah, it did look good, but I was just like, “Cool, okay.”

Bart: Why did you start with that?

McKenzie: Yeah, why did you start with that? But anyway, we sewed it together in my childhood bedroom, and then made it into a little elastic band. I subsequently added the key ring on it cause I thought it needed a little bit more functionality than just . . . if you’ve seen a Thread Wallet, the original Thread Wallet. That’s how it started out, and then we did a really, really . . . I wasn’t even really part of it. He had a friend help him with this one, but they did a Kickstarter in early 2014 where they raised about $8,000.

Bart: Okay.

McKenzie: It wasn’t a huge push, but they met their goal, which helped them invest in a printer of their own to be able to sublimate, and the equipment to sublimate on the elastic. We started doing little small batches, small test runs, and we’re fortunate enough to know the buyer at a local boutique and we got them in there, and then we sold them at farmer’s markets and got validation through that.

McKenzie: They would like just fly off the shelves and then in 2000 . . . so that was 2014, beginning of 2015, we had been married by then. We’re like, “Okay, we’re going to hit this really hard and see what we can do in the next six months, and if it works then we’ll keep pushing it, and if it doesn’t work then we’ll pivot and change.” Within those six months we’d launched another Kickstarter that was more put together and had more thought process behind it, and we did $35,000 on the second Kickstarter in 2015; then launched our website at the end of May and saw a lot of success with that. We were growing our social media channels and so we just kept pushing. That’s kind of–

Bart: In those early days you were making it yourselves?

McKenzie: Yes. Yeah.

Bart: What was the bottleneck? Was that a bottleneck, I guess?

McKenzie: Oh. Oh my gosh, yes.

Bart: You had more demand than you could keep up with?

McKenzie: Yes, it was such a . . . it was such a bottleneck. We got into a few small retailers, and we would make them on-demand, whenever the retailers would ask, “Hey, can you give us 50 wallets today?” And we’d make them right then, and then the same with our website. We’d make maybe 10 of each design, and then when those 10 got bought, purchased, then we would make 10 more. We were doing it in my parents’ home. We lived with my parents for the first . . . like those six months that we said that we would push the business. So yeah, keeping production in-house, by ourselves, in my bedroom that I had growing up, and in my parents’ house was a big bottleneck.

Bart: So somewhere in there you got married?

McKenzie: Yes. Yep.

Bart: It sounds like.

McKenzie: 2014. August 2014.

Bart: Okay, and was that before the business actually started?

McKenzie: I had . . . The business officially started in January of 2015. 2014 is when Colby and I were dating, and I kind of helped–

Bart: Kind of testing it?

McKenzie: To sell the . . . Yeah. For the first prototypes, I was definitely a user, and then when we got married, my husband had the option to pursue professional soccer or this wallet idea, which kind of seems silly to say. At the time we were like, “Is that gonna even work?” And his dad is a financial planner, so he’d kind of passed the option through his mind of going in that route and working with his dad. So, we sat down, and he had gone through some tryouts for soccer and was being recruited. He was 24 at the time, which isn’t old, 24-25. But in the soccer world, everyone starts professional at around like 17-18 and then grows into it.

Bart: Yeah.

McKenzie: He was like, “I’ve got a short career in this.” This would not be long term, and it–

Bart: And you said he’s super entrepreneurial.

McKenzie: Yeah, he’s super entrepreneurial. So he was like, “I need to build something that’s going to stay. I can’t just go and invest in soccer. It’s brutal on your body, and the training and everything.” So he was like, “I want to just focus on the business, and I think we have an idea here with Thread that will work.” I remember we were in my little brother’s room and he called the coach of the team that was recruiting him and just said, “Hey, I . . .” He was on track to be their pick and he just called and said, “I’m going to stick with my business instead.” So–

Bart: That’s a big sacrifice.

McKenzie: Yeah. I mean, he was . . . I’m his wife so I can brag, but he was really, really talented. Soccer was a really big part of his life ever since he was like four or five. So, it was a big sacrifice, but he doesn’t regret it, and I definitely don’t regret it. I’ve been able to spend a lot more time with him doing this than I would have been able to if he did soccer.

Bart: What did you think about . . . Did you feel like those were the only two options, or did you feel like, “Hey, you could actually work with your dad . . .” A little bit more–

McKenzie: You know, that was definitely an option. My dad is also a financial planner, and so I had seen . . . not the toll it can take on like family relationships, because my dad has been a great father and has really figured out the balance between being at work and being at home with the family, but I ‘d always wanted a husband that I was closer with and that was more available in terms of: Let’s go on a trip, or let’s do this; like–

Bart: A little more flexiblity?

McKenzie: A little more flexibility, and so the fact that my husband wanted to seek out a career through entrepreneurship to accommodate that freedom, we’re both . . . we both are very . . . he’s a freedom chaser. He hates being told what to do, hates being restricted.

Bart: Yeah.

McKenzie: And I’m very stubborn and independent, and so a traditional nine-to-five, I don’t think would have worked for us at all. I’m glad that we started when we were young, because we did it when we didn’t have kids. We did it when we didn’t have any huge responsibilities. I think it would have been harder to get into the corporate world and then have kids and turn around and be like, “Now let’s trade all these benefits and all these awesome things for all this risk.” At that time we didn’t really have a ton of risks. That six month trial period we gave it wasn’t . . . I mean, if we had failed at it, we would have just figured something else out and we had other options. His dad, you know . . . so, yeah. I don’t know if that answers your question.

Bart: Yeah, that’s fantastic. Every time you got an order in those early days, it was exciting, but it was also–

McKenzie: Oh my gosh, it was so amazing.

Bart: It was super exciting, it sounds like, but it was also like, “Oh, now we have to make all this.”

McKenzie: Oh, yeah. Yeah, we had to make it. We were doing all the shipping ourselves, doing all the marketing. Everything was my husband and I. Every time you’d see an order come in, it was so cool because it was like, “Whoa, how did someone from Michigan hear about us?” Or, “Whoa, there’s people up in Salt Lake or Idaho are hearing about us.” You’re, like, stoked on that stuff but it was definitely stressful, trying to . . . Every time we’d go out of town, we didn’t have anyone else to . . . like if we went on a family trip to Lake Powell over the summer, we’d have to make sure that our . . . My cousin could come over and ship them, and that we’d have enough inventory of one design. If we didn’t, we’d stick the envelopes in the boxes where the the inventory sat, and I’d have to come home from the trip and know, “Okay, I’m going to have to sew 50 of that design.” It was always kind of a game of catch up.

Bart: Right. You wanted that flexibility, but you were starting to recognize you had to make that.

McKenzie: Yes. Yeah.

Bart: If you look back, what are some of the key things you did to gain that initial traction? Because that’s hard. You talked about Kickstarter, you talked about social media.

McKenzie: Yes.

Bart: Did you do paid advertising as well?

McKenzie: When we first started out that was not . . . paid advertising wasn’t part of our game. We were really lucky because we got on the influencer social media marketing when it wasn’t really like paying for influencers yet.

Bart: Oh, okay.

McKenzie: That was so . . . I mean this was the beginning of 2014 when we really were kind of testing the waters and started building that social media feed and stuff.

Bart: Right.

McKenzie: And some of those relationships. We are really lucky that we were able to establish some good relationships with micro-influencers and macro-influencers. People who have larger followings, people who have smaller followings.

Bart: You mostly did unpaid product collaborations over time.

McKenzie: Yes, yeah. Unpaid product collaborations, and then we also . . . this is going to . . . I mean, if you have a product that can do this, I would recommend it. Our product and our price point is really inexpensive.

Bart: Yeah.

McKenzie: And so we would go and just hand out product at local campuses, and then like anyone who ever asked for product, we’d give it at events. We would give it. We’d do events at local juice bars where we’d just post and be like, “Hey, come and we’re going to give out product.” I think that helps spiral the–

Bart: Get the word out.

McKenzie: Yeah, just get the word out. It was good because it was really good user feedback really early on and then also just establishing a presence and a connection with the local community. I think that that really helped us start.

Bart: It sounds like there was a little bit of a spray and pray sort of strategy, or were you tracking? When you gave out 20 wallets on campus, did you kind of track and say, “Hey, follow us on social media,” and then you could see it?

McKenzie: Yeah, I wish that . . . Back then we probably could have done more tracking, but a lot of it was just, there definitely was on social media . . . Like I just mentioned, we did that thing at a local juice bar where we invited people and then gave out free wallets. I remember, I wasn’t able to attend that event because I was babysitting at the time, still trying to find ways to bring in extra income to our family because we weren’t really paying ourselves yet. I was just sitting on my phone because I could see all these people tagging us. That was back before stories and all that stuff, but it was still cool to see like, “Whoa, people are there and they went for our product.” It was so early on still, so, I mean, very minimal tracking, but through little things like that, social media.

McKenzie: Back then, we were using Squarespace instead of Shopify and so the analytics back then weren’t as great either when you’re trying to figure out where things are coming from, and what’s driving traffic.

Bart: As you look back, is there anything you would do differently as you just got started?

McKenzie: Yes. One of the biggest things that we would have done differently is . . . We talked about production here. We were doing it all in-house. My husband had gotten on Alibaba and sourced a small production run of our product. He’d sent a sample over–

Bart: Yeah.

McKenzie: And pictures, and then they came back. Looking back on it, they were nearly perfect.

Bart: Wow.

McKenzie: They were . . . just the . . . I mean our product is pretty simple, but there was a difference in the size and the elastic looked a little too shiny, like the way that they printed on it. So I , not knowing much about manufacturing or anything, we just kind of gave up. We were like, “Oh, well it’s not perfect, so they must not be able to do it.”.

Bart: Interesting.

McKenzie: And so we just kind of threw in the towel really early on, which was really silly because I think if we would’ve just run some more production samples with that same company, we probably . . . or manufacturers, a supplier, we probably could have nailed it down, but I’m a little bit of a control freak and I wanted our product to be perfect.

McKenzie: I was really nervous about that, but then back right before we had our first child in 2000 . . . end of 2016, beginning of 2017, we moved things over to China completely because I just couldn’t do it any more. We found someone to help us source it, and then we figured out how to do it on our own after that.

Bart: So it was a couple of years after that first attempt?

McKenzie: Yeah, a year and a half, two years. I mean, once we got production overseas and out of our house, that’s when things really started to–

Bart: Yeah.

McKenzie: That and shipping. Once I handed . . . I was doing all the shipping because again, I’m a perfectionist. I wanted to know how it looked, how it was packaged, but I couldn’t with a baby on the way, so we took off those hats and once we did, things were really able to start scaling because that’s when we could put our focus and our time and our energy where our talents could actually be utilized and developed instead of just focusing on shipping and sewing wallets.

Bart: Now when you get orders, you’re just happy.

McKenzie: Yes, I don’t even have to look at them. It’s amazing.

Bart: So tell us a little bit more about starting and running a business with your spouse. It sounds like he’s totally entrepreneurial.

McKenzie: Yes.

Bart: You said you’re both kind of independent and–

McKenzie: Yes.

Bart: I mean, how has it been? Has it been challenging at all?

McKenzie: Yes. I will be the first person to tell you that it has not been easy, and there’s a lot of people when we talk to them, they’re like, “Oh my gosh, I could never run a business with my spouse. I would want to kill him,” but I think because we started out . .. . That’s what our whole . . . We started dating, and we were talking about business ideas and I was helping him sew the first prototypes, and then we got married and we were selling them at farmer’s markets. It’s always been part of our relationship.

Bart: Right.

McKenzie: I think it would be . . . I think about at some point in the future when Thread maybe isn’t as big of a part of our lives, like if we sell it or whatever happens with it, and I’m like, “That would be really weird.”

Bart: What would you even talk about?

McKenzie: What are we going to do? But it definitely has had its challenges. I think we actually say that it’s really helped our marriage because the arguments or disagreements or things that we’ve had to work with, a lot of people don’t have to face in their marriage. Our business was our first baby, and so it was learning how to navigate that. I think communication-wise, we’ve been able to navigate a lot of things that others might not have to because they don’t spend 24/7 with each other.

Bart: Right.

McKenzie: But we definitely have had differences. At first, it was really hard because we were both doing it and it was just Colby and I, and so figuring out what lane you’re in, and who’s in charge of what, and not stepping into each other’s lanes was really a hard thing to do because you both care so much about the outcome and what’s going to happen with the business, or what’s gonna happen with marketing. What’s gonna happen with production? What’s going to happen? You both have so many opinions; so there was a lot of head-butting in the first few years and then even now we still have arguments.

McKenzie: We’re moving into a new office space, hopefully within the next month, and there’s disagreements about how we should build it out and all that stuff. It’s definitely been challenging, but it’s so worth it because at the end of the day you’re building something together, and it’s helped us work through a lot of problems. I feel like we become stronger in the end because we’re working towards the same goal. I mean, just like I said, it was our first baby. Just as when you have kids or something, you’re working towards the same outcome, same goal, same future with it, and so–

Bart: Yeah, you’re a team.

McKenzie: It brings you together in so many ways.

Bart: Shared experiences.

McKenzie: Yes. Yeah.

Bart: A lot of fulfillment.

McKenzie: Oh, so much fulfillment. Yeah, it’s the best.

Bart: Tell us a little bit about Thread Heads. How has that helped Thread Wallets grow?

McKenzie: Thread Heads is our ambassador program, and we have a really awesome girl on our team, Lily, who manages that. We just noticed . . . I mean, we get direct messages and emails all the time with people wanting to be ambassadors for Thread Wallets, and we noticed that those people who were asking, plus other people who we just reached out to, were really excited to talk about the product and share about it, but in a really authentic way. Our Thread Heads, we don’t require much from them. We’re not like a: “You have to post once a week,” like a lot of ambassador programs, you get requirements. You have to post on your story twice and post on your feed this many times and use this code and all of that. We just treat our ambassadors like family and we send them product for their friends’ birthdays and we–

Bart: Oh, that’s cool.

McKenzie: One of our ambassadors is from the Netherlands. She’s a big skater, and she just posted on her story about a shoe company or a shoe that she wanted, but they don’t ship to the Netherlands, they don’t ship internationally. We bought her the pair of shoes here and then shipped them over to her.

Bart: Wow, that’s going way out of your way to–

McKenzie: Yeah. We try to treat them like family and just try to treat them right. I think in the world of social media there’s a lot of like set expectations where it’s like . . . it’s not relationship building. It’s just: How can this person bring money into our company or spread awareness?

Bart: Yeah, what’s their value?

McKenzie: Yeah, but we’ve just wanted it to be very casual but very authentic. Most of our Thread Heads post very consistently, very frequently. They’re tagging us in everything, but that’s without any set requirement for that, and it’s just because we’re going in with . . . One of my biggest philosophies in marketing is going into relationships with a hand open instead of a hand down. So it’s what you can give instead of what you can take.

Bart: Yeah. That’s awesome.

McKenzie: That’s our Thread Head program. We just started it a year and a half ago, about a year ago, probably. It has driven brand awareness and it has increased our sales, but it’s more about the relationships and establishing connections with people who we feel like are a good fit with the brand and who we want to be friends with.

Bart: You even feature them on your website.

McKenzie: Mm-hmm. Yeah, we feature them on our website. We feature them on our blog and our Instagram. We want to give them, like I said, what we can give instead of what we can take. We’ve found that it’s fun to use our platform to give them a voice for things. We’ve had Thread Heads write blog posts for us or talk about their experiences in whatever industry they’re in, or things like that, so it’s really fun.

Bart: That sounds like a really fun part of the marketing strategy. Is it part of the marketing strategy?

McKenzie: Yeah. Yeah.

Bart: Okay. Can you talk a little about how the marketing has evolved as the Chief Marketing Officer? You’ve been involved from the beginning in trying to grow and gain traction. It sounds like it came reasonably. I don’t want to discount what you’ve done, but it came pretty well, pretty easily. How have you grown that over time?

McKenzie: The biggest thing, like I said at the get-go, was . . . With our Thread Heads, I have tried to keep them and maintain the philosophy that it’s about relationships more than it is about trying to make a buck off of somebody. I think that’s why some of the marketing has come . . . not easy. It’s been a difficult journey and you have to pivot and change and figure out what’s working, and your strategies evolve. But I think we had a lot of success at the beginning, and even now because we do that “no-strings attached”. We just want to send you stuff; we love you.

McKenzie: When we first started our Kickstarter campaigns, that’s all we did was . . . Even our Instagram was just like, “We would love to send you product. Don’t worry about posting. We just know you’ll love it.” But then they don’t have that pressure and so they end up posting about it and stuff.

Bart: Does that ever backfire?

McKenzie: There’s people who don’t post. There’s people who might not say anything, but–

Bart: But you don’t see that as backfiring?

McKenzie: No, because you’re still getting your product into the hands of people that have influence in their demographic or their category, and if they use the product, we know they’re going to love it. Their friends might see it and purchase or become a . . . We’ve had people who reach out and said like, “Hey, I saw my friend with your product. Can I be an ambassador?” Maybe they’re not as big or . . . I don’t know what it is, but we’re stoked that they’ve seen their friends use our product and then want to be part of the team and part of our journey.

Bart: It sounds like a lot of organic marketing. Organic, kind of–

McKenzie: Yeah.

Bart: Sharing. Have you started to do paid advertising as well at this point?

McKenzie: Yes. Yeah, yeah. We run Facebook ads, Instagram ads. We have Google, Snapchat, so many different platforms.

Bart: Digital online advertising.

McKenzie: Yeah.

Bart: You have a team now, how many people are working for Thread Wallets?

McKenzie: We’ve got about 12, 13. We’ve got some that are full-time, some that are part-time, and then the guy that runs our ads is a contractor. We work with an agency, but he’s been with us since literally almost the beginning, probably eight months into starting Thread. He, at the beginning, was just helping here and there doing some consulting and testing a few things out, but he’s been with us and he’s part of the team, part of the family.

Bart: That’s very cool.

McKenzie: Yeah.

Bart: I mean, it sounds like the way you’re talking about this kind of abundance mentality, this kind of sharing without expectations is, I’d say, not as popular as one might think today because a lot of businesses are really looking at: How can we just do this small testing, see what we get? Tracking, everything’s very targeted. What do we get? What do we get for what we’re investing in this business? And that’s not bad. I’m not trying to make that sound negative.

McKenzie: Oh no, not at all. You should be. You want to be tracking things. Yeah.

Bart: But what you’re saying is with an abundance mentality, you’re creating more value and spreading more value than you’re trying to capture, and you’re less worried about the capture because you have confidence in your product, confidence in your brand, and confidence that people will love that product, and ultimately, that that’s what will grow your business.

McKenzie: Yeah, definitely.

Bart: I love that mentality.

McKenzie: Yeah, I think it’s really important in these times, in this day and age, to keep that as part of what you’re trying to do with your business; is not just take, but give back.

Bart: You’re five years in. Was there a specific time, looking back on these last five years when you reached some milestone and you thought to yourself, “Hey, Colby and I, we’ve made it.”.

McKenzie: Oh man. Every night we go to bed just so humbled at what we’ve been able to build, that we have a team, and that we’re able to do this and we’re profitable. A lot of startups don’t reach profitability until multiple years in, and we were profitable first year. So that was a really, really beautiful blessing and we thank God everyday for what we’ve been given. I don’t know if there ever has been like an “We made it” moment. I think . . . this is going to sound so cheesy, but when I hear it . . . more than anything financial, or . . . we’ve reached a lot of really great financial goals, and we’re still pushing with those, so I feel like that’s why I can’t say we’ve made it yet there, because we reach one goal, and it’s like, “Okay, that’s cool, but then that’s the next level.”

Bart: There’s always that next level.

McKenzie: But when I hear my employees, or they post on their Instagram stories, “I have a dream. This is my dream job.” Those are the moments when I’m like, “Okay, we’ve made it.” Someone is so happy to be working for us and they feel like we’re treating them right and with respect, and knowing that we’re providing other people with jobs and a creative environment where they feel fulfilled, those are the moments where I’m like, “Okay, we’ve made it.” Again, I want to offer that for more people. Let’s push so we can have 20 employees. Let’s push so we can have 30 employees. Dynamics change a little bit when you’re growing and you have 20 employees or 30 employees as compared to five.

Bart: Right.

McKenzie: But those are the moments when I’m like: Yeah, I can go to bed at night and I’m like, that’s cool. That’s what makes me happy and feel successful.

Bart: I love that. I love that you’re talking a lot about relationships and not just your customers, but your employees too. You’re building a team. You’re looking out for people. I guess the last question: What’s next for Thread Wallets? Where are you going from here?

McKenzie: What’s next for Thread? That is a very good question. Our website, Amazon, everything is going pretty well, but we haven’t dived too much into the retail space and so we want to test that out. That’s something that’s big that’s on the horizon. We’re really trying to stay niche with wallets and products that revolve around that, so iPhone wallets or phone case wallets, things like that. Try to stay niche so we can really make a name for ourselves, and then perhaps in the future, introduce side bags or fanny packs or backpacks but still maintain that cohesiveness of: These are products that are carrying other things like your cards, your essentials.

McKenzie: So, that’s kind of where we’re going. We’re just looking to expand more with our employees and bring more creative people onto the team to help fine tune everything. I feel like every step you’re kind of like, “Okay, now we’re here,” but with a startup and with entrepreneurship, I feel like it’s always a little bit messy. Figuring out new systems, putting systems in place to track everything, or accountability. When it was just Colby and I, accountability was, “Oh, did you get that done? Sweet. Okay, awesome.” Yeah, but now with 12 employees, 13 employees, we’ve got another person coming on within the next week or two. You’ve got to figure out: Okay, how are we going to hold everyone accountable? A big part of our goals for this year and even into 2020 is just establishing systems and processes that help us be able to stay so that we can grow into the future and have our team grow with us so that there’s not hiccups with all these little things that you don’t think about when you start a company. Then you get to it and you’re like, “Oh, well you gotta have a good system for taxes and accounting and all that stuff.” That’s–

Bart: You don’t want to wing it with taxes and accounting.

McKenzie: No. You don’t. We’ve done that. We’ve done that first year and probably even our second. That was not fun to try to come up with money that you don’t have to pay taxes that you don’t want to pay. But yeah, systems, just like I said, building a company that can stay and continue to provide fulfilling jobs for people and just to always have fun. We love having a business. It’s so fun. Those are our goals.

Bart: That’s fantastic. If people want to check out Thread Wallets, where should they go?

McKenzie: You can go to our website, which is www.threadwallets.com. Instagram is @thread_wallets. Yeah, those are our two biggest channels, just trying to keep it really simple.

Bart: McKenzie, thanks so much for joining us today.

McKenzie: Yeah! So happy to have been here.

Bart: You’ve said a lot of things that our builders can certainly relate to, and Thread sounds like it’s clearly headed in a great direction. We’re excited to watch you on this journey. Builders, don’t forget to check out builttostay.com for downloadable content and links to some of our favorite Thread Wallet products.

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